5 replies to this topic

[sheiko]

Hello,

Working in an EPC company, i would like to know what are the key information a process engineer must provide to Piping Design in a Tie-In list and why.

I also would like to know the basic steps for planning, designing and constructing such Tie-In's in a Revamp project.

In a nutshell, what a Process Engineer must know about Tie-In's?

Please feel free to share any documentation you could. I have googled "piping tie in" but i did not find that much relevant information.

Thanks.

Edited by sheiko, 06 March 2010 - 12:36 PM.

[ankur2061]

Hello,

Working in an EPC company, i would like to know what are the key information a process engineer must provide to Piping Design in a Tie-In list and why.

I also would like to know the basic steps for planning, designing and constructing such Tie-In's in a Revamp project.

In a nutshell, what a Process Engineer must know about Tie-In's?

Please feel free to share any documentation you could. I have googled "piping tie in" but i did not find that much relevant information.

Thanks.

Sheiko,

The tie-in related document that we prepare in my organization is titled as Tie-in & Shutdown philosophy and besides the project background it contains an important table which has the following information:

1. Tie-in number e.g. T-001

2. Location/description of tie-in point e.g. T-001 located upstream of control valve PCV-XXX & on line number 4"-P-XXXX-XXX

3. Remarks column which describes whether I need to shut-down that line or section of the process where piping will need to provide the tie-in when the tie-in is required to be provided in a revamp or modification job. Alternatively, the remarks column may also mention the boundaries of piping and vendor package (skid) or piping & instrumentation scope. The remarks should be concise & to the point to prevent any ambiguity.

This information should suffice for the piping group to proceed with appropriate tie-in representation and remarks on the Piping GA/isometric drawings. Additionally piping could send the piping GA/isometric drawing for a squad check to process to ensure that what they have understood from the information provided by process group is correctly represented in their drawing.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Ankur.

[kkala]

Working in an EPC company, i would like to know what are the key information a process engineer must provide to Piping Design in a Tie-In list and why.
I also would like to know the basic steps for planning, designing and constructing such Tie-In's in a Revamp project.

- Tie-in lists depend on the Project organization, too. As a Process Engineer I currently specify any tie-in on the (interconnecting) PID, with any other piping element in the vicinity (valve, control valve, etc), and write (on the PID): size of the connected pipe, fluid, where the fluid comes from. Process activity on the subject stops here, unless there is a revision.
- Name of the tie-in, routing the connected pipe to its origin (passing from several PIDs) and defining its design pressure and temperature are elaborated by Piping / Project.
- After that interconnecting PIDs, line list, tie-in list are issued. Tie-in list can contain line numbering and class,reference PID, whether shutdown is needed (usually yes, unless hot tap is applied), other consise remarks.
- Next step is the elaboration of piping arrangements and isometrics.

Edited by kkala, 08 March 2010 - 05:51 AM.

[sheiko]

Thank you very much everyone!

1/ Could you please tell me what is a typical tie-in numbering philosophy (are PID number, fluid code required?)?

2/ I have found the following steps for Tie-In planning. Can you identify missing steps or additionnal one that you believe should be included?

1. Identify each Tie-In(s) schematic location on P&ID - Process Engineer
2. Review with Piping - Process & Piping Design
3. Create a Tie-In List with key information about each Tie-In -
Piping Design & Process Engineer
4. Review with Client - Process Engineer
5. Go to the Field to locate physical point of Tie-In - Piping
Design/Process
6. Meet with plant personnel and review Tie-In requirements -
Piping Design, Process, Plant Operations, Safety
7. Discuss different types and configurations of Tie-Ins - Piping
Design, Process and Plant personnel
8. Establish physical Tie-In location point and type - Piping
Design & Plant Personnel
9. Define if the line can be shut –down, when, how long, draining,
depressuring, steam-out and other safety issues - All personnel
10. Visually inspect the existing pipe. Are more extensive tests
needed to determine condition and suitability for the Tie-In -
Piping Design and Plant personnel
11. Mark or tag the selected Tie-In point - Piping Design & Plant Personnel
12. Photograph the Tie-In point - Piping Design
13. Draw sketch and take all required measurements - Piping Design
14. Determine locations of all existing block valves, vents and
drains - Piping Design
15. Determine the location of all existing anchors and guides -
Piping Design
16. Based on selected Tie-In location and type determine if
additional vents or drains will now be required - Piping Design,
Plant Operations
17. Include new vents or drains (if any) on sketch - Piping Design
18. Insure that this process is followed for all Tie-Ins - All participants
19. Get plant personnel to sign off on all data collected in the
field - Piping Design & Process Engineering
20. In the office modify the P&ID as required - Process Engineer
21. Convert all field sketches into appropriate production drawings
(Isometrics) - Piping Design
22. Prepare a Plot Plan style "Tie-In Location Key Plan"
23. Update the Tie-In List as required - Piping Design
24. Review all Tie-Ins with Pipe Stress for effect on existing
system piping and new system piping - Piping Design
25. Finalize (check, correct and approve) all Tie-In isometric
drawings - Piping Design

Regards

Edited by sheiko, 08 March 2010 - 03:28 PM.

[Qalander (Chem)]

Thank you very much everyone!

1/ Could you please tell me what is a typical tie-in numbering philosophy (are PID number, fluid code required?)?

2/ I have found the following steps for Tie-In planning. Can you identify missing steps or additionnal one that you believe should be included?

1. Identify each Tie-In(s) schematic location on P&ID - Process Engineer
2. Review with Piping - Process & Piping Design
3. Create a Tie-In List with key information about each Tie-In -
Piping Design & Process Engineer
4. Review with Client - Process Engineer
5. Go to the Field to locate physical point of Tie-In - Piping
Design/Process
6. Meet with plant personnel and review Tie-In requirements -
Piping Design, Process, Plant Operations, Safety
7. Discuss different types and configurations of Tie-Ins - Piping
Design, Process and Plant personnel
8. Establish physical Tie-In location point and type - Piping
Design & Plant Personnel
9. Define if the line can be shut –down, when, how long, draining,
depressuring, steam-out and other safety issues - All personnel
10. Visually inspect the existing pipe. Are more extensive tests
needed to determine condition and suitability for the Tie-In -
Piping Design and Plant personnel
11. Mark or tag the selected Tie-In point - Piping Design & Plant Personnel
12. Photograph the Tie-In point - Piping Design
13. Draw sketch and take all required measurements - Piping Design
14. Determine locations of all existing block valves, vents and
drains - Piping Design
15. Determine the location of all existing anchors and guides -
Piping Design
16. Based on selected Tie-In location and type determine if
additional vents or drains will now be required - Piping Design,
Plant Operations
17. Include new vents or drains (if any) on sketch - Piping Design
18. Insure that this process is followed for all Tie-Ins - All participants
19. Get plant personnel to sign off on all data collected in the
field - Piping Design & Process Engineering
20. In the office modify the P&ID as required - Process Engineer
21. Convert all field sketches into appropriate production drawings
(Isometrics) - Piping Design
22. Prepare a Plot Plan style "Tie-In Location Key Plan"
23. Update the Tie-In List as required - Piping Design
24. Review all Tie-Ins with Pipe Stress for effect on existing
system piping and new system piping - Piping Design
25. Finalize (check, correct and approve) all Tie-In isometric
drawings - Piping Design

Regards

Dear Congrats,
Since you have great professional advises with you now and the info of your above post is very comprehensive indeed.

I will humbly draw your attention towards a tiny word "service" being very important for any process, piping or project engineer(s) that covers a lot in one single word.

Best of luck 'sheiko' for successful accomplishment.

[kkala]

2/ I have found the following steps for Tie-In planning. Can you identify missing steps or additionnal one that you believe should be included?
1. Identify each Tie-In(s) schematic location on P&ID - Process Engineer
3. Create a Tie-In List with key information about each Tie-In -Piping Design & Process Engineer
4. Review with Client - Process Engineer
-- Interconnecting PIDs (See thread by lury, 24 Feb 10, Refining, Hydr, oil &gas).
5. Go to the Field to locate physical point of Tie-In - Piping Design/Process
8. Establish physical Tie-In location point and type - Piping Design & Plant Personnel
11. Mark or tag the selected Tie-In point - Piping Design & Plant Personnel
12. Photograph the Tie-In point - Piping Design
-- Line list , completed with design pressures
16. Based on selected Tie-In location and type determine if additional vents or drains will now be required - Piping Design, Plant Operations
20. In the office modify the P&ID as required - Process Engineer check for additional valves, CVs, PSVs
21. Convert field sketches and interconnecting PIDs into appropriate production drawings (Piping arrangements / Isometrics) - Piping Design
22. Prepare a Plot Plan style "Tie-In Location Key Plan" have not seen such dwg, yet it could be useful
24. Review all Tie-Ins and connected piping with Pipe Stress for effect on existing
system piping and new system piping - Piping Design
25. Finalize (check, correct and approve) all Tie-In isometric drawings and arrangements - Piping Design
-- Client may often ask for additional tie-ins during the activity, so have a careful contractual provision for such Changes .

The list by sheiko is a sincere effort to control the whole task and is abbreviated above to show (judged) main points. My experience on the activity is limited (Process engineers have limited role in my present work) but some comments (according to my understanding) are added in bold.
It is also noted that:
1. An organized factory has interconnecting PIDs for all its area, only new lines have to be added up to their tie-ins.
2. In addition to tie-in list, line list and updated interconnecting PIDs have to be elaborated (and approved by Client), before starting piping arrangements/ isometrics.
3. At least here data by Client are not quite completed or updated; so work on field is critical for the success of the task, and the list by sheiko shows the need of checking. There may be missing lines / other data on existing drawings given to you.

Edited by kkala, 11 March 2010 - 04:25 PM.